Author Topic: Thank You For This!  (Read 4585 times)

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Offline DJLunacy

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Thank You For This!
« on: May 31, 2019, 11:45:00 am »
Galleon,

I'm new here! I've been lurking for a bit. The nostalgia bug has hit me once again.

Thank You, for providing this wonderful program. It's amazing that I'm now to run a game I had been working on forever ago.

I'm amazed that I've even been able to get this thing to run, let alone compile, let alone add new code that's more modern.

Great Job!

Offline TempodiBasic

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2019, 06:33:04 am »
Hi DJLunacy
Yes I can only  follow you in thanking Galleon for its creature and for sharing it with others, not only like users but also like developers.
First great thing is to run again old QBasic code
Second great thing is to have a new empowered language that let us easily code programs in Qbasic style and in actual modern OSes and machines.
Third great thing is to have the multiplatform support (Windows, Mac, Linux) that teorically can be shifted also towards Android and something other as soon as the  C/C++ can be ported in that new platform. (here there is the possibility of a QB64VirtualMachine like the old Java has done before)

Thanks again
Programming isn't difficult, only it's  consuming time and coffee

Offline Pete

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2019, 11:06:24 am »
With Android?! When pigs fly! Oh well, if that ever happens, it's a win, win for me; because I like bacon with my roast duck!

Pete :D
Want to learn how to write code on cave walls? https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/qbasic/qbasic-f1/

Offline TempodiBasic

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2019, 07:56:59 pm »
Hey Pete
but do you shoot to flying animals?
Quote
that teorically can be shifted also towards Android and something other as soon as the  C/C++ can be ported in that new platform
Do you think that the C/C++ output of compiler is anyway unusable for compiling for other Oses?
Programming isn't difficult, only it's  consuming time and coffee

Offline SMcNeill

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2019, 09:09:36 pm »
Hey Pete
but do you shoot to flying animals?Do you think that the C/C++ output of compiler is anyway unusable for compiling for other Oses?

Before Galleon quit working on QB64, he was developing the language to compile on Android.  From my personal experience, small programs were able to be compiled (I successfully compiled a set of Hello World, Dice Roller, and Yahtzee programs for Android), but the issue was all the hoops that had to be jumped through to make things work.  99.98% of the user base couldn’t follow the complex instructions and make the process work, and I think the grief Galleon got from frustrated users is why he basically just dropped working on the project.

Galleon is a helluva coder, but not so good at creating documentation or instructions.  His style was just, “here it is, figure it out, I’m moving on to something else,” and since it wasn’t as simple as just clicking a button labeled, “compile to Android”, most folks just bitched how it never worked, rather than trying to sort out the assembly needed to make it work.

If you grab a version of QB64 1.0, I *think* it’s the one which can create an Android project for you.  Once Galleon left, nobody else wanted to debug or maintain the Android support, so it was basically stripped out, without the user-base even noticing the difference.

If you’re feeling Adventurous, grab the old version and check the internet archives and hope you can find the instructions to attempt the process.  Clippy got his “CalenDos” program to work (a QB45 era calendar program he wrote around the dawn of the Stone Age), and I had some minor successes with small things, but for most people, the project was never completed even to work for the vast majority of them.
https://github.com/SteveMcNeill/Steve64 — A github collection of all things Steve!

Offline Pete

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2019, 11:13:31 pm »
The only reason CaleDos runs on Android because I converted it to SmallBasic, and posted it at N54, for Clippy. SmallBasic compiles and runs on Android without ANY bullshit, period. Rob would have really had something if he was able to pull something similar to what Chris accomplished.

SmallBasic is great for small Android programs, but it is a bit too limited in respects to QB64. Still, it makes use of some text libraries and other features that makes doing some programming projects easier, but not customizable. It was by far and away the best of all the Android Basic languages I experienced.

Pete



Want to learn how to write code on cave walls? https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/qbasic/qbasic-f1/

Offline TempodiBasic

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2019, 04:50:48 am »
Glad to read all these informations

about my affirmation
Quote
Do you think that the C/C++ output of compiler is anyway unusable for compiling for other Oses?
because I have read this   
Quote
Code written in C/C++ can be compiled to ARM, or x86 native code (or their 64-bit variants) using the Android Native Development Kit (NDK). The NDK uses the Clang compiler to compile C/C++. GCC was included until NDK r17, but removed in r18 in 2018.
here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_software_development and I have no technical informations about compilers (my C/C++ is in the time of DOS with TurboC/C++, in those times the most concerning was about the huge use of  RAM and math calculations and so the compiler options to use and the libraries to include)

but I see that there are also compiler C/C++ in android OS
https://developerinsider.co/c-compiler-for-android-run-c-c-programs-on-android/
https://www.quora.com/Which-is-the-best-C-or-C++-compiler-in-Android

So the original plan of Galleon was to make a QB64 in Android OS or to let a CrossPlatform QB64IDE (writing in Win or Linux or Mac and installing /running on Android?
Thanks to reply

PS
(Sorry I'm talking about C/C++ because for now QB64 is C/C++ translated also if someone talked about a Java shifting)
Programming isn't difficult, only it's  consuming time and coffee

Offline FilipeEstima

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2019, 07:46:32 pm »
SmallBasic is great for small Android programs, but it is a bit too limited in respects to QB64. Still, it makes use of some text libraries and other features that makes doing some programming projects easier, but not customizable. It was by far and away the best of all the Android Basic languages I experienced.

Pete
Is this what you are referring to? https://apkpure.com/smallbasic/net.sourceforge.smallbasic

Offline Pete

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2019, 08:09:42 pm »
Yes.
Want to learn how to write code on cave walls? https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/qbasic/qbasic-f1/

Offline bplus

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2019, 08:49:33 am »
SmallBASIC has a board at Retro forum, Chris, the developer, is moderator:
https://retrogamecoding.org/board/index.php?board=22.0

Offline Raven_Singularity

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2019, 10:50:48 am »
Is Galleon still around?

Once I have my QB64 animation library finished, I was going to look into hiring someone to assist with updating QB64 to support cross-compiling QB64 apps for Android.  I read about the former Android support being removed, and was sad to see it go.

If anyone out there is capable of doing this porting work for Android support, what's an estimate on how much money you would require to make it worth your while?

And a huge thank you to Galleon for making QB64 happen!
« Last Edit: June 12, 2019, 11:32:30 am by Raven_Singularity »

Offline Pete

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2019, 11:28:19 am »
I started using SmallBasic to run a few thing I wanted on Android. It's close to QB syntax. It is strict when it comes to strings.

Galleon (Rob) is still around. I emailed him a few months ago. He has a family now and he's moved on from QB64. He did have a dream of rewriting it, and making it more JAVA like, if I recall correctly. He got the GL conversion from SDL accomplished, after some bumps in the road, and I recall he talked about incorporating OOP support. I think that after estimating the work involved, real life won out. The other problem with decades long project is the industry can pull the rug right out from under you at any time, or keep you modifying your project, or jut adds new bells an whistles you can't ever seem to keep up with. It's really freaking amazing to me one person could get so far. Also, I know he'd rather code his own projects in QB64 than C/C++, so at least there is that for him. I know how he feels. When I code in Basic, I can lose track of time. When I code in C/C++, time just stands still.

A few years back, "Clippy" offered $1000 to anyone who could get QB64 to port to Android, seamlessly. No takers.

Android keyboard, touchscreen, etc. would also have to be incorporated in QB64, to make it worth running on an Android device.  I doubt you will find anyone with the time around here, or all the knowledge needed, to accomplish what you are asking for. Anyway, I'd just thought I toss in some history. If you wanted to try and reach Rob yourself, you can easily find it by reading the first few lines in this code: http://www.qb64.org/wiki/Email_Demo

Pete
Want to learn how to write code on cave walls? https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/qbasic/qbasic-f1/

Offline Raven_Singularity

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Re: Thank You For This!
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2019, 11:42:19 am »
When I code in Basic, I can lose track of time. When I code in C/C++, time just stands still.

Agreed!  I've lost endless hours in BASIC, and it always feels warm and cozy.  I find in other programing languages I spend too much time debugging or working around quirks and oddities, usually a lot more time spent debugging than coding.  BASIC tends to be more consistent, and rarely has bugs that take me more than a couple hours to solve.


A few years back, "Clippy" offered $1000 to anyone who could get QB64 to port to Android, seamlessly. No takers.

I would assume it would take several times that much to make it worthwhile.  Hence me asking.  :-)


Android keyboard, touchscreen, etc. would also have to be incorporated in QB64, to make it worth running on an Android device.  I doubt you will find anyone with the time around here, or all the knowledge needed, to accomplish what you are asking for.

Straight ports of mouse-based apps to Android do work -- such as SDL-based apps -- as long as there's no use of right-click, middle-click, or mousewheel.  For my usage case, left-click would be fine.  I also don't need to have custom Android touchscreen features added, like long-press, pinching, multi-touch, etc.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2019, 11:45:03 am by Raven_Singularity »